25. Thus, on average, from October 2022 to May 2023, we received 38% of the requested requirement.
26. The same situation with weapons and military equipment: the supply of Wagner PMC in terms of tanks, artillery and armored vehicles amounted to 30-40% of the required amount for combat missions.
27. How to calculate the required amount of ammunition? There are many different options:
- First: from the experience of conducting combat operations, taking into account the number, including the missing tanks, artillery, armored vehicles and weapons for the previous period. So, in our opinion, this is the most practical option.
- Second: according to the norms determined by the Rules for firing and fire control, the consumption of ammunition for suppressing an enemy platoon stronghold is 180 shells per 1 hectare. The average length of the Wagner front, taking into account different periods, is 80 km. This is about 400 strongholds of the enemy. To suppress them, 180 x 400 are needed, that is, 72 thousand shells per day. And so every day.
- Third: to suppress one NATO mechanized division for a conditional operation (25 days), about 270 thousand calculated ammunition (152 mm) is needed, according to the methodology of operational-tactical calculations. One NATO division is 12 thousand people. 35 thousand is three divisions. Three divisions - 270 thousand times 3 (for suppression) - 810 thousand shells. We divide by 25 days - we get 32 thousand shells per day for suppression.
28. I remind you: we asked for 6,000 shells a day, they signed us from 600 to 1,000 shells, and we received 1,5-2,000 shells a day.
29. For example, in order not to reveal secrets: 10 types of ammunition that were ordered for the first decade of May. Requested by PMC "Wagner" 45 thousand, signed for the issuance of 5800 shells.
30. Thanks to Colonel General Mizintsev for giving out a little more than they signed at the General Staff. Very little, but at least something. Since May 1, after his dismissal, they are no longer issued at all.
VI. How does the lack of ammunition affect sanitary losses?
31. To maintain combat effectiveness during a full-scale war, losses (“200s” and “300s”) of 10-12% in 25 days (the duration of a conditional military operation) are considered acceptable.
The arithmetic is very simple:
- If they give 18 thousand shells per day, the losses are 10%;
- If they give 6 thousand shells per day, the losses are 24%;
- If they give 2 thousand shells per day, the losses are 35% or more.
Nobody expects 10% of ammunition from the norm. In this case, the unit is doomed to death. Now we get 10%.
32. PMC "Wagner" according to military calculations should give 18 thousand shells per day. And there should be weapons [X] x 3. In this case, the losses would be 10-12% in a full-fledged war. The Wagner PMC had not [X] x 3, but [X] weapons, so we asked not 18, but 6 thousand shells. In this situation, our losses should have been 24%, with 6 thousand shells. But we were given 2,000 thanks to the efforts of the responsible generals and Mizintsev. Therefore, our calculated loss should have been 35% for every 25 days. That is, PMC "Wagner" for 6 months "Bakhmut meat grinder" was supposed to lose 200% of the personnel.
33. It should be noted that with a loss of 30%, the unit is considered not combat ready. We had to complete one combat mission (25 days): die and reformat, and so on 14 times in a row. Instead, we have been at war for 14 months in a row. This speaks of the insane effectiveness of Wagner PMC. These are standard calculations taught at the General Staff.
34. Of course, the losses, once again, thanks to the highest level of training, management and interaction, are lower than calculated. But PMC "Wagner" still suffered significant losses, and despite this, we are alive: interaction, control and morale have not been lost.
35. PMC "Wagner" is artificially brought to non-combat readiness due to the artificially created "shell hunger".
26. The same situation with weapons and military equipment: the supply of Wagner PMC in terms of tanks, artillery and armored vehicles amounted to 30-40% of the required amount for combat missions.
27. How to calculate the required amount of ammunition? There are many different options:
- First: from the experience of conducting combat operations, taking into account the number, including the missing tanks, artillery, armored vehicles and weapons for the previous period. So, in our opinion, this is the most practical option.
- Second: according to the norms determined by the Rules for firing and fire control, the consumption of ammunition for suppressing an enemy platoon stronghold is 180 shells per 1 hectare. The average length of the Wagner front, taking into account different periods, is 80 km. This is about 400 strongholds of the enemy. To suppress them, 180 x 400 are needed, that is, 72 thousand shells per day. And so every day.
- Third: to suppress one NATO mechanized division for a conditional operation (25 days), about 270 thousand calculated ammunition (152 mm) is needed, according to the methodology of operational-tactical calculations. One NATO division is 12 thousand people. 35 thousand is three divisions. Three divisions - 270 thousand times 3 (for suppression) - 810 thousand shells. We divide by 25 days - we get 32 thousand shells per day for suppression.
28. I remind you: we asked for 6,000 shells a day, they signed us from 600 to 1,000 shells, and we received 1,5-2,000 shells a day.
29. For example, in order not to reveal secrets: 10 types of ammunition that were ordered for the first decade of May. Requested by PMC "Wagner" 45 thousand, signed for the issuance of 5800 shells.
30. Thanks to Colonel General Mizintsev for giving out a little more than they signed at the General Staff. Very little, but at least something. Since May 1, after his dismissal, they are no longer issued at all.
VI. How does the lack of ammunition affect sanitary losses?
31. To maintain combat effectiveness during a full-scale war, losses (“200s” and “300s”) of 10-12% in 25 days (the duration of a conditional military operation) are considered acceptable.
The arithmetic is very simple:
- If they give 18 thousand shells per day, the losses are 10%;
- If they give 6 thousand shells per day, the losses are 24%;
- If they give 2 thousand shells per day, the losses are 35% or more.
Nobody expects 10% of ammunition from the norm. In this case, the unit is doomed to death. Now we get 10%.
32. PMC "Wagner" according to military calculations should give 18 thousand shells per day. And there should be weapons [X] x 3. In this case, the losses would be 10-12% in a full-fledged war. The Wagner PMC had not [X] x 3, but [X] weapons, so we asked not 18, but 6 thousand shells. In this situation, our losses should have been 24%, with 6 thousand shells. But we were given 2,000 thanks to the efforts of the responsible generals and Mizintsev. Therefore, our calculated loss should have been 35% for every 25 days. That is, PMC "Wagner" for 6 months "Bakhmut meat grinder" was supposed to lose 200% of the personnel.
33. It should be noted that with a loss of 30%, the unit is considered not combat ready. We had to complete one combat mission (25 days): die and reformat, and so on 14 times in a row. Instead, we have been at war for 14 months in a row. This speaks of the insane effectiveness of Wagner PMC. These are standard calculations taught at the General Staff.
34. Of course, the losses, once again, thanks to the highest level of training, management and interaction, are lower than calculated. But PMC "Wagner" still suffered significant losses, and despite this, we are alive: interaction, control and morale have not been lost.
35. PMC "Wagner" is artificially brought to non-combat readiness due to the artificially created "shell hunger".
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36. How do we survive? The answer is simple. Management, optimization, military tricks, interaction, immediate repair, restoration and modernization: both military equipment and personnel who, having been wounded, undergo a quick recovery course and again rush to perform combat missions. Because we are a monolithic team of like-minded people.
37. These qualities allowed us to grind about 50 thousand soldiers of the Armed Forces of Ukraine killed and prevent the enemy’s counteroffensive until today along the entire front line.
VII. Where are the projectiles?
38. The Russian military industry has reached the volume of production of shells sufficient to provide in full about 5 such combat-ready formations as the Wagner PMC, with a front length of 120-150 km and a simultaneous offensive along all sectors of the front.
39. The volume of stockpiles of weapons and ammunition makes it possible to provide for everyone, including in standard quantities.
40. It is safe to say that two-thirds of the sanitary losses of PMC "Wagner" are caused exclusively by artificially created "shell hunger". These are tens of thousands of killed and wounded citizens of the Russian Federation who died and suffered severe injuries due to the artificially created “shell hunger”.
41. It must be borne in mind that many other units are also experiencing "shell hunger." It was assumed that if they received shells, they would share them with the Wagner PMC. Therefore, the termination of the activities of PMC "Wagner" will have a positive impact on other units and subunits, and will provide them with ammunition.
37. These qualities allowed us to grind about 50 thousand soldiers of the Armed Forces of Ukraine killed and prevent the enemy’s counteroffensive until today along the entire front line.
VII. Where are the projectiles?
38. The Russian military industry has reached the volume of production of shells sufficient to provide in full about 5 such combat-ready formations as the Wagner PMC, with a front length of 120-150 km and a simultaneous offensive along all sectors of the front.
39. The volume of stockpiles of weapons and ammunition makes it possible to provide for everyone, including in standard quantities.
40. It is safe to say that two-thirds of the sanitary losses of PMC "Wagner" are caused exclusively by artificially created "shell hunger". These are tens of thousands of killed and wounded citizens of the Russian Federation who died and suffered severe injuries due to the artificially created “shell hunger”.
41. It must be borne in mind that many other units are also experiencing "shell hunger." It was assumed that if they received shells, they would share them with the Wagner PMC. Therefore, the termination of the activities of PMC "Wagner" will have a positive impact on other units and subunits, and will provide them with ammunition.
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Media is too big
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‼️ Под свистом снарядов облагораживают город! Коммунальщики латают дороги в Петровском районе.
Сегодня они работали там, где буквально несколько часов назад ложились снаряды ВСУ, а среди мирных были раненые. Но с риском для жизни сотрудники красят остановки, подметают улицы и латают дороги в прифронтовом районе.
Источник: ТРК "Юнион"
Сегодня они работали там, где буквально несколько часов назад ложились снаряды ВСУ, а среди мирных были раненые. Но с риском для жизни сотрудники красят остановки, подметают улицы и латают дороги в прифронтовом районе.
Источник: ТРК "Юнион"
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☝️ По оперативным линиям СЦКК ДНР за 6 мая по состоянию на 19:00 поступила дополнительная информация о жертвах среди гражданских лиц в городах Республики:
г. Донецк (Петровский район):
🧨 Обстрел в 10:45:
- по переулку Красноармейcкий, дом 7 погибла женщина 1937 года рождения.
🧨 Обстрел в 17:40:
- по улице Ингулецкая, дом 2 погибла женщина 1976 года рождения.
❗️ Поступила дополнительная информация о повреждениях в результате обстрелов ВСУ городов Республики:
г. Донецк (Петровский район):
- улица 40 лет Украины, дом 6 "а" - многоквартирный жилой дом;
- улица Карнавальная, дома 56 и 77 – частные жилые дома.
г. Донецк (Петровский район):
🧨 Обстрел в 10:45:
- по переулку Красноармейcкий, дом 7 погибла женщина 1937 года рождения.
🧨 Обстрел в 17:40:
- по улице Ингулецкая, дом 2 погибла женщина 1976 года рождения.
❗️ Поступила дополнительная информация о повреждениях в результате обстрелов ВСУ городов Республики:
г. Донецк (Петровский район):
- улица 40 лет Украины, дом 6 "а" - многоквартирный жилой дом;
- улица Карнавальная, дома 56 и 77 – частные жилые дома.
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Ещё один день в Петровском районе Донецка. Два человека погибли. Одна из женщин не дождалась дня, чтобы стать гражданкой России. Завтра она должна была получить паспорт РФ.
По району всë также прилетают снаряды от ВСУ калибром 155 мм.
По району всë также прилетают снаряды от ВСУ калибром 155 мм.
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Words of Wisdom from The Commander, Alexander Khodakovsky - (VERY important info here, if you can read between the lines.)
"Many volunteers of the fourteenth year ended up in PMCs, giving such a phenomenon as a private military company a purely Russian connotation. We had an unequivocal attitude towards American PMCs - mercenaries. But knowing that motivated people went to the PMCs created by us, who before that, completely free of charge, stood up in defense of high meanings and ideals - it was impossible to say about our PMCs that this is a bunch of military adventurers who value nothing but good money. And now it is even more impossible - no amount of money can compensate for the risks and losses.
The experience of this war showed that in a private structure it is possible to introduce the most effective methods of management, minimizing the negative impact of the military bureaucracy. I certainly can’t imagine the soap consumption logs in PMCs. And many were carried away by the formula for organizing military work in PMCs, especially in matters of interaction and decision-making, which still remains a considerable problem for the army. However, when, after joining Russia, the security forces in the DPR, who are not part of the Ministry of Defense, were asked about joining the proposed PMC, Vostok refused, clearly deciding on the direction - to the National Guard.
Now those features of PMCs that have not yet shown themselves have become apparent. If, according to the presidential decree, "state" military personnel are not fired until the end of the war, with the exception of certain categories, then this does not apply to PMCs, and the owner, for whatever reason, can make a separate decision in this matter. Not only that: at the expiration of the contract, the owner is obliged to release the employee if he does not want to renew the contract, and when it comes to thousands of people at the same time, this gives rise to a crisis that, along with a general shortage of shells and natural combat losses, puts the owner in front of a difficult choice.
In the course of a changeable war, both the strengths and weaknesses of private traders were revealed to us. The private traders showed us how to organize the work in order to squeeze the maximum efficiency out of the available forces and means. But at the same time, we saw how little the state can influence its private "partner" if he has his own ideas. If we were able to take the best and quickly put it into practice, this would be a good result of a public-private partnership. But, unfortunately, what can be implemented within the framework of a small system does not take root well within the framework of a large system - a different physics of processes. And, nevertheless, we have only one prospect: to build an effective state force, subordinated not to private will, but to the interests of the country, without abandoning PMCs in other areas where state intervention would be unprofitable."
"Many volunteers of the fourteenth year ended up in PMCs, giving such a phenomenon as a private military company a purely Russian connotation. We had an unequivocal attitude towards American PMCs - mercenaries. But knowing that motivated people went to the PMCs created by us, who before that, completely free of charge, stood up in defense of high meanings and ideals - it was impossible to say about our PMCs that this is a bunch of military adventurers who value nothing but good money. And now it is even more impossible - no amount of money can compensate for the risks and losses.
The experience of this war showed that in a private structure it is possible to introduce the most effective methods of management, minimizing the negative impact of the military bureaucracy. I certainly can’t imagine the soap consumption logs in PMCs. And many were carried away by the formula for organizing military work in PMCs, especially in matters of interaction and decision-making, which still remains a considerable problem for the army. However, when, after joining Russia, the security forces in the DPR, who are not part of the Ministry of Defense, were asked about joining the proposed PMC, Vostok refused, clearly deciding on the direction - to the National Guard.
Now those features of PMCs that have not yet shown themselves have become apparent. If, according to the presidential decree, "state" military personnel are not fired until the end of the war, with the exception of certain categories, then this does not apply to PMCs, and the owner, for whatever reason, can make a separate decision in this matter. Not only that: at the expiration of the contract, the owner is obliged to release the employee if he does not want to renew the contract, and when it comes to thousands of people at the same time, this gives rise to a crisis that, along with a general shortage of shells and natural combat losses, puts the owner in front of a difficult choice.
In the course of a changeable war, both the strengths and weaknesses of private traders were revealed to us. The private traders showed us how to organize the work in order to squeeze the maximum efficiency out of the available forces and means. But at the same time, we saw how little the state can influence its private "partner" if he has his own ideas. If we were able to take the best and quickly put it into practice, this would be a good result of a public-private partnership. But, unfortunately, what can be implemented within the framework of a small system does not take root well within the framework of a large system - a different physics of processes. And, nevertheless, we have only one prospect: to build an effective state force, subordinated not to private will, but to the interests of the country, without abandoning PMCs in other areas where state intervention would be unprofitable."
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Forwarded from Александр Ходаковский
Много добровольцев четырнадцатого года в итоге оказалось в ЧВК, придав такому явлению, как частная военная компания, сугубо российский оттенок. К американским ЧВК отношение у нас было однозначным - наёмники. Но зная, что в создаваемые у нас ЧВК пошли люди мотивированные, которые перед этим совершенно бесплатно грудью встали на защиту высоких смыслов и идеалов - сказать про наши ЧВК, что это сборище военных авантюристов, не ценящих ничего, кроме хороших денег, было нельзя. А сейчас нельзя тем более - никакие деньги не компенсируют рисков и потерь.
Опыт этой войны показал, что в частной структуре можно внедрить самые эффективные методики управления, минимизировав отрицательное влияние военной бюрократии. Вот уж точно не представляю себе журналов учёта расходования мыла в ЧВК. И многие увлеклись формулой организации военной работы в ЧВК, особенно в вопросах взаимодействия и принятия решений, что для армии по-прежнему остается немалой проблемой. Однако, когда после присоединения к России перед силовиками в ДНР, не входящими в систему Минобороны, поставили вопрос о вхождении в предполагаемую ЧВК , то "Восток" отказался, чётко определившись по направлению - в Росгвардию.
Сейчас стали очевидны и те особенности ЧВК, которые до сих пор себя не проявляли. Если согласно указа президента "государственных" военнослужащих не увольняют до окончания войны, за исключением отдельных категорий, - то на ЧВК это не распространяется, и собственник в силу каких-либо причин может принимать в этом вопросе отдельное решение,. Мало того: по истечению срока контракта собственник обязан отпустить сотрудника, если тот не хочет продлевать контракт, а когда речь идёт о тысячах человек одновременно, то это рождает кризис, который наряду с общим снарядным дефицитом и естественными боевыми потерями ставит собственника перед тяжёлым выбором.
В ходе переменчивой войны перед нами открылись и сильные, и слабые стороны частников. Частники показали нам, как можно организовать работу, чтобы выжать из имеющихся сил и средств максимум эффективности. Но одновременно мы увидели, насколько слабо может государство влиять на своего частного "партнера", если у того возникают собственные соображения. Если бы мы умели брать лучшее и быстро внедрять это в практику - это было бы хорошим результатом государственно-частного партнёрства. Но, к сожалению, что может быть внедрено в рамках малой системы - плохо приживается в рамках системы большой, - другая физика процессов. И, тем не менее, перспектива у нас только одна: строить эффективную государственную силу, подчинённую не частной воле, а интересам страны, не отказываясь от ЧВК на других направлениях, где вмешательство государства было бы невыгодным.
Опыт этой войны показал, что в частной структуре можно внедрить самые эффективные методики управления, минимизировав отрицательное влияние военной бюрократии. Вот уж точно не представляю себе журналов учёта расходования мыла в ЧВК. И многие увлеклись формулой организации военной работы в ЧВК, особенно в вопросах взаимодействия и принятия решений, что для армии по-прежнему остается немалой проблемой. Однако, когда после присоединения к России перед силовиками в ДНР, не входящими в систему Минобороны, поставили вопрос о вхождении в предполагаемую ЧВК , то "Восток" отказался, чётко определившись по направлению - в Росгвардию.
Сейчас стали очевидны и те особенности ЧВК, которые до сих пор себя не проявляли. Если согласно указа президента "государственных" военнослужащих не увольняют до окончания войны, за исключением отдельных категорий, - то на ЧВК это не распространяется, и собственник в силу каких-либо причин может принимать в этом вопросе отдельное решение,. Мало того: по истечению срока контракта собственник обязан отпустить сотрудника, если тот не хочет продлевать контракт, а когда речь идёт о тысячах человек одновременно, то это рождает кризис, который наряду с общим снарядным дефицитом и естественными боевыми потерями ставит собственника перед тяжёлым выбором.
В ходе переменчивой войны перед нами открылись и сильные, и слабые стороны частников. Частники показали нам, как можно организовать работу, чтобы выжать из имеющихся сил и средств максимум эффективности. Но одновременно мы увидели, насколько слабо может государство влиять на своего частного "партнера", если у того возникают собственные соображения. Если бы мы умели брать лучшее и быстро внедрять это в практику - это было бы хорошим результатом государственно-частного партнёрства. Но, к сожалению, что может быть внедрено в рамках малой системы - плохо приживается в рамках системы большой, - другая физика процессов. И, тем не менее, перспектива у нас только одна: строить эффективную государственную силу, подчинённую не частной воле, а интересам страны, не отказываясь от ЧВК на других направлениях, где вмешательство государства было бы невыгодным.
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Forwarded from Wartime Media - Ukraine / Russia / China / Etc
Media is too big
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"I shout to thieves : give that ammo to Wagners"
An emocional video was released in support of Wagners. It features Shoigu's daughter, who is famous for being married to a lame liberal.
The society is raging and discussing this very dramatic situation.
An emocional video was released in support of Wagners. It features Shoigu's daughter, who is famous for being married to a lame liberal.
The society is raging and discussing this very dramatic situation.
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Forwarded from Оркестр | W
❗️ "Сегодня ночью мы получили боевое распоряжение. Нам обещают дать боеприпасы и вооружение столько, сколько нам требуется для продолжения дальнейших действий.
ㅤ
Нам клянутся, что на фланги будет выставлено все, что необходимо, чтобы нас не подрезал противник.
Нам дают Суровикина, как человека, который будет принимать решения в рамках взаимодействия с Минобороны.
Если кто-то хочет, он может перейти в другие формирования. все однозначно ответили "нет" в нецензурной форме".
Евгений Пригожин
@orchestra_w
ㅤ
Нам клянутся, что на фланги будет выставлено все, что необходимо, чтобы нас не подрезал противник.
Нам дают Суровикина, как человека, который будет принимать решения в рамках взаимодействия с Минобороны.
Если кто-то хочет, он может перейти в другие формирования. все однозначно ответили "нет" в нецензурной форме".
Евгений Пригожин
@orchestra_w
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"I don't remember a case in world history when soldiers blackmailed the military department, demanding that they be given ammunition so that they could fight. They didn't ask for benefits. Not an increase in contentment. Not facilitating conditions of service. And the ability to keep fighting.
And that the Minister of War should not react to these demands until they become public. Just a unique case. Impossible and unimaginable before." INDEED...
And that the Minister of War should not react to these demands until they become public. Just a unique case. Impossible and unimaginable before." INDEED...
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Forwarded from Hard Blog
Не припомню в мировой истории случая, когда солдаты шантажировали военное ведомство, требуя дать им боеприпасы, чтобы они могли сражаться. Требовали не льгот. Не повышения довольствия. Не облегчения условий службы. А возможности продолжать сражаться.
И чтобы военный министр не реагировал на эти требования, пока они не стали достоянием общественности. Просто уникальный случай. Невозможный и невообразимый ранее.
И чтобы военный министр не реагировал на эти требования, пока они не стали достоянием общественности. Просто уникальный случай. Невозможный и невообразимый ранее.
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Forwarded from Hard Blog
Не припомню в мировой истории случая, когда солдаты шантажировали военное ведомство, требуя дать им боеприпасы, чтобы они могли сражаться. Требовали не льгот. Не повышения довольствия. Не облегчения условий службы. А возможности продолжать сражаться.
И чтобы военный министр не реагировал на эти требования, пока они не стали достоянием общественности. Просто уникальный случай. Невозможный и невообразимый ранее.
И чтобы военный министр не реагировал на эти требования, пока они не стали достоянием общественности. Просто уникальный случай. Невозможный и невообразимый ранее.
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From Oleg Tsarev today -
"Prigozhin was promised to be given weapons and ammunition, to cover the flanks, and Surovikin was singled out as responsible from the Defense Ministry for PMCs.
The best solution is if the PMC completely liberates Artyomovsk. Finish what he started.
I read that some accused Prigozhin of sending PMC fighters into attacks without artillery support, and because of this, many guys die. Others accused him of trying to leave the front line in wartime. They say war is war. There is an order to storm without shells, which means he must storm. But think about it, the easiest way out of the situation is to give PMCs shells. Then the task will be completed, and the losses will be minimal.
I hope this ends. PMC will receive shells. Russia will receive Artyomovsk."
I (Texas) would add, about those above who say "war is war, attack without shells" are most certainly cowards and hypocrites who have never been anywhere near a war. When I was a soldier on the Front, many times I said and heard from other soldiers, "We are ready to die if we must, but not for a stupid reason." A LOT of good men have died in the SMO for stupid reasons, and while the _promise_ of proper support for Wagner is encouraging, it's just bullshit until it actually happens, and until those who caused deaths for stupid reasons are held responsible (and they haven't been yet) good men will keep dying for stupid reasons.
"Prigozhin was promised to be given weapons and ammunition, to cover the flanks, and Surovikin was singled out as responsible from the Defense Ministry for PMCs.
The best solution is if the PMC completely liberates Artyomovsk. Finish what he started.
I read that some accused Prigozhin of sending PMC fighters into attacks without artillery support, and because of this, many guys die. Others accused him of trying to leave the front line in wartime. They say war is war. There is an order to storm without shells, which means he must storm. But think about it, the easiest way out of the situation is to give PMCs shells. Then the task will be completed, and the losses will be minimal.
I hope this ends. PMC will receive shells. Russia will receive Artyomovsk."
I (Texas) would add, about those above who say "war is war, attack without shells" are most certainly cowards and hypocrites who have never been anywhere near a war. When I was a soldier on the Front, many times I said and heard from other soldiers, "We are ready to die if we must, but not for a stupid reason." A LOT of good men have died in the SMO for stupid reasons, and while the _promise_ of proper support for Wagner is encouraging, it's just bullshit until it actually happens, and until those who caused deaths for stupid reasons are held responsible (and they haven't been yet) good men will keep dying for stupid reasons.
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